Psfracer new car build- 2.3 whipple in the 9's?

**psfracer** · 03-01-2009, 12:08 PM

This thread will document what I do to get an S197 mustang, running only a 2.3 Whipple into the 9's--no other power adder, no nitrous. I do not think there is another 2.3 whipple S197 out there that is in the 9's (all though I could be mistaken). Please post up if you know of one.

Also, after this post there are a few dummy posts. These I will edit and add information over the next couple months--so all of the info will be in the first 4 posts, vs scattered through 20 pages and 200 posts.

First--why am I here. Well as some of you may know this car:

Now looks like this as a result of an accident with an 18 wheel semi truck:

So, what to do? I had three different directions I could go, but in the end I decided to go with an S197 Mustang again, and I found one already mostly set up for drag racing---just without engine. That was fine as I already had a great engine anyway.

So here is the car I am going with:

This car already has a chrome moly roll bar with swing outs. Rear suspension already set up with strange rear shocks, BMR LCA's with solid mounts, UCA, and BMR anti roll bar.

And the real reason why I went this route--the car has already been converted from the 5R55S to a race 4R70W. With labor thats a $4K upgrade right there.

So, how to get to the 9's with only a 2.3 whipple as a power adder (no nitrous)??

Thats what this thread will cover. The engine will only have 2 more lbs of boost, 18 psi, so I will only have 600 rwhp to play with.

So with only 600rwhp, it should be obvious what direction I have to go with this car. Weight reduction, with the proper drivetrain, trans set up, and suspension.

Keep in mind, the last time I ran my car on Jan 3rd and 4th, I was at a 10.544--but that was on 16psi boost, still had A/C, and still completely stock front suspension except front sway bar removed.

So the project begins. As of today, engine, trans, rearend, etc is out of the old car. The old car is now gone.

According to this calculator, I will need roughly 650rwhp at 3400lbs to break into the 9's. Looks like alot of work, but I feel it is possible. http://www.wallaceracing.com/accel-calc.php

UPDATE 5/25/2009

Well, I officially returned to the track today. Good news: the car hit over 131 mph on several passes, best being 131.28mph. The not so great news is the track prep was not excellent, but good, but the car was 60' a little weaker then normal which hurt ETS. Best ET was a 10.44, and several 10.47s, 10.48s.

Based on the MPH, this car has an easy 10.2X in it. Since I drove directly from the shop to the track, I still have not installed the rear seat delete, and several other weight saving tidbits. Still, I don't think 9's will be possible without help from a blue bottle.

Here are some pics and some timeslips so far:

If you look at the 330' times--they are all a full tenth off what I just ran at Irwindale a couple days ago with a best of 4.227. So, like I said above, just some more dialing in the car, and myself, should get this car in the 10.2X's.

UPDATE 08/13/2009

Put Cobra Jet Springs in the back, changed to a Goodyear 29X11X15 slick, and completed the weight savings program.

At Famoso the car turned a 10.277, a 10.280, and a 10.314 with a best 133.96 mph, just missing 134 mph.

At Irwindale on 8/13/09, car ran very consistent as well, with 60' times of 1.432, 1.438, 1.427, and 1.454. Best ET was a 6.539 @ 105.85 mph. I think the Cobra Jet Springs definitely made a difference, as the car is still in the 1.42-1.43 area with a tire that is at least a full 1 inch taller then the M&H 325 I used to run.

UPDATE 11/21/09

GETTING CLOSER! Only thing different is I changed the plugs, and actually had great conditions at a 1/4 mile track (Famoso). Temps in the very low 60s, great DA, good track prep. A new best of 10.138 @ 132.39 (lifted in the lights) backed up by a 10.194 @ 133.55---all with stock heads and stock cams still!!

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/W...-at_720918.htm

**psfracer** · 03-01-2009, 12:09 PM

Front Suspension:

1) BMR tubular front K member -20lbs
2) BMR tubular a-arms non adjustable - 11lbs
3) Front sway bar crossmember delete - 11lbs (only 11 as I had already removed the stock front sway bar)
4) Strange front brake kit -36lbs
5) A/C delete -38lbs
6) Battery relocation to trunk
7) Intercooler water tank relocated to trunk

So as it stands right now, I took off 116 lbs off of the front end alone. And that doesn't include going with the bogarts up front either--or moving the battery to the back--just the installed parts above.

Here is the difference between the stock and BMR a-arms. That rear bushing on the stock one is huge, and is probably the source of most of the weight savings vs the bmr ones:

Strange front brake kit weighs in at 33lbs

Here is the strange kit installed on the car. It really looks like a quality kit--all though I haven't driven it yet---but if they stop as good as they look.....

Only the lines are left, then the front suspension is done.

A/C Delete: I already detailed how to remove the A/C in another thread, post #35:
http://s197forum.com/forum/showthrea...t=10934&page=2

Rear Suspension:

Sticking with how the car is set up--as this car has also has a best 60' time of 1.41X.

1) Strange engineering adjustable rear shocks.
2) BMR UCA and LCAs with solid mounts
3) BMR anti roll bar

May add some anti squat brackets if needed. Geometry seems to be fine as it sits right now.

**psfracer** · 03-01-2009, 12:09 PM

What I have planned for the interior so far:

1) Stereo delete (shaker 1000) -82lbs
2) Rear seat delete -25lbs (including all metal brackets, seat belts, etc)
3) Passenger seat delete -48lbs (with brackets)
4) Driver seat delete -60lbs (with brackets and power motors)
5) Kirkey seat, brackets, and cover +23lbs

So as it stands right now, interior mods should yield somewhere in the neighborhood of 190lbs vs stock!!

Stereo will be removed--with my gauge panel in its place:

UPDATE 5/30/09

I installed the rear seat delete today. Could have made it myself for $30 but whatever---I had to cut two holes to make room for the roll bar--then I covered it up with the roll bar padding which makes it look pretty clean:

There were alot of metal brackets, seat belts, etc I removed also, as I won't need them anymore.

Kirky seat has already been installed, with belts, I just cleaned up the interior with simple green.

I also installed my GHETTO dash camera mount. It works good, and with the camera actually on the mount, the only thing you can see is the black steel plate.

TRUNK

The battery box is now mounted in the spare tire wheel well along with the intercooler water tank. This places the weight of the 7 gallons of water and the battery square on the rear suspension. Also, this way it was easy to mount the master disconnect switch right where the license plate would normally go. The battery box I used was just the plain black one from Summit. It works great and was pretty inexpensive as well.

**psfracer** · 03-01-2009, 12:11 PM

ENGINE MODS

Old set up was 2.3 whipple, 16psi, 577rwhp.

1) 10% overdrive crank pulley added. This will net me 600rwhp at 18+ psi
2) race tune to maximize custom CAI and sheet metal intake (believe it not I never got around to it)

These two items should put me a little bit over the 600rwhp mark. But according to this calculator, I will need closer to 650 to break into the 9's at 3400lbs. http://www.wallaceracing.com/accel-calc.php

Here is the dyno video:

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/2...yno_683319.htm

OR

DRIVETRAIN

1) Detroit Locker
2) Moser axles with 3 inch studs

All this time I have been running the stock limited slip. I have replaced the clutches once, but now have stepped up and decided to go with a locker. Should be able to 60' even better, as the stock limited slip was already starting to go out a second time.

OTHER WEIGHT REDUCTION

Exhaust mod: got ride of the axle backs and the exhaust tubing off of the x-pipe. Went with straight mufflers, which saved 26lbs per side, or 52lbs total.

ETS SO FAR:

Best 1/8th mile time so far a 6.49 @ 106 mph which should translate to a 10.1X at 133-134 mph.

Best 1/4 mile time so far is a 10.377 @ 133 mph

VIDEO OF SOME PASSES

UPDATE 11/21/2009 Car turned a best 10.138 @ 132.39 MPH today at FAMOSO. Also turned a 10.19 and a 10.22. See video below:

**GI Joe** · 03-01-2009, 12:16 PM

crap man sorry to hear about your loss...but it looks like you have a good plan to turn lemons in to lemonaid...
Gook Luck.

DKO · 03-01-2009, 12:16 PM

Damn Paul, nothing can keep you down! Congrats on the new ride, glad to hear that you're getting right back to it!

**MLC40** · 03-01-2009, 01:13 PM

+1 happy this is moving in a positive direction.

Chris06GT · 03-01-2009, 01:19 PM

Paul, I knew you were parting out the old car, but never knew what had happened....that sucks man, just glad you are ok....Roll bar done its job huh?....

On another note, I am glad to see you found another car, and it even looks like the old car...lol...Also, good luck with your goal, that would be an awesome accomplishment!!!!

**Vapour Trails** · 03-01-2009, 01:24 PM

Looks like you found the perfect car, even the same color!

**thump_rrr** · 03-01-2009, 01:41 PM

Congrats on finding the perfect roller Paul.

Is there a weight difference between what you were running as a trans to the 4R70W?
Can you show in detail how those swingouts open please?
I've never seen one that clean looking before.
Do you now have 2 sets of Bogarts and will you be keeping both sets?

**ILW84U** · 03-01-2009, 01:44 PM

Nice to see you're sticking with the S197. It looks as though you have a spare set of drag wheels now? Hopefully it won't be too long before you are back behind the wheel & racing again.

**thump_rrr** · 03-01-2009, 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thump_rrr

Do you now have 2 sets of Bogarts and will you be keeping both sets?

Quote:

Originally Posted by ILW84U

It looks as though you have a spare set of drag wheels now?

Beat you to it pal.

**Freaknazty** · 03-01-2009, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thump_rrr

can you show in detail how those swingouts open please?

+10000000000000000000

**Freaknazty** · 03-01-2009, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thump_rrr

Beat you to it pal.

lol beat yall both to it i asked him about them last week

Racingtheburg · 03-01-2009, 01:51 PM

What size wheels are your street wheels?

**thump_rrr** · 03-01-2009, 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Freaknazty

lol beat yall both to it i asked him about them last week

Bastard LOL
We need proof

**Freaknazty** · 03-01-2009, 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thump_rrr

Bastard LOL

lol snooze ya loose , nah me and him been bs'n back n forth about the ride in general n shit then i asked him about them but i don't know what's up aint talked to him about the new ride

**thump_rrr** · 03-01-2009, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Freaknazty

lol snooze ya loose , nah me and him been bs'n back n forth about the ride in general n shit then i asked him about them but i don't know what's up aint talked to him about the new ride

I'm actually waiting to hear back from someone on another set of rears right now.

**don_w** · 03-01-2009, 02:21 PM

So Paul... should we change your screen name to Whipple Chick now?

Seriously, I'm looking forward to the new build, and I hope you get to the 9's!

**jp's performance** · 03-01-2009, 03:06 PM

that looks just like brandi's car is it.nice grab

03-01-2009, 12:08 PM	#1
psfracer Prepare for glory! $psfracer's Avatar$ Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: 30 miles north of Los Angeles Posts: 3,791 iTrader: 16 / 100% $psfracer has a spectacular aura about$ $psfracer has a spectacular aura about$ $psfracer has a spectacular aura about$	Psfracer new car build- 2.3 whipple in the 9's? This thread will document what I do to get an S197 mustang, running only a 2.3 Whipple into the 9's--no other power adder, no nitrous. I do not think there is another 2.3 whipple S197 out there that is in the 9's (all though I could be mistaken). Please post up if you know of one. Also, after this post there are a few dummy posts. These I will edit and add information over the next couple months--so all of the info will be in the first 4 posts, vs scattered through 20 pages and 200 posts. First--why am I here. Well as some of you may know this car: Now looks like this as a result of an accident with an 18 wheel semi truck: So, what to do? I had three different directions I could go, but in the end I decided to go with an S197 Mustang again, and I found one already mostly set up for drag racing---just without engine. That was fine as I already had a great engine anyway. So here is the car I am going with: This car already has a chrome moly roll bar with swing outs. Rear suspension already set up with strange rear shocks, BMR LCA's with solid mounts, UCA, and BMR anti roll bar. And the real reason why I went this route--the car has already been converted from the 5R55S to a race 4R70W. With labor thats a $4K upgrade right there. So, how to get to the 9's with only a 2.3 whipple as a power adder (no nitrous)?? Thats what this thread will cover. The engine will only have 2 more lbs of boost, 18 psi, so I will only have 600 rwhp to play with. So with only 600rwhp, it should be obvious what direction I have to go with this car. Weight reduction, with the proper drivetrain, trans set up, and suspension. Keep in mind, the last time I ran my car on Jan 3rd and 4th, I was at a 10.544--but that was on 16psi boost, still had A/C, and still completely stock front suspension except front sway bar removed. So the project begins. As of today, engine, trans, rearend, etc is out of the old car. The old car is now gone. According to this calculator, I will need roughly 650rwhp at 3400lbs to break into the 9's. Looks like alot of work, but I feel it is possible. http://www.wallaceracing.com/accel-calc.php UPDATE 5/25/2009 Well, I officially returned to the track today. Good news: the car hit over 131 mph on several passes, best being 131.28mph. The not so great news is the track prep was not excellent, but good, but the car was 60' a little weaker then normal which hurt ETS. Best ET was a 10.44, and several 10.47s, 10.48s. Based on the MPH, this car has an easy 10.2X in it. Since I drove directly from the shop to the track, I still have not installed the rear seat delete, and several other weight saving tidbits. Still, I don't think 9's will be possible without help from a blue bottle. Here are some pics and some timeslips so far: If you look at the 330' times--they are all a full tenth off what I just ran at Irwindale a couple days ago with a best of 4.227. So, like I said above, just some more dialing in the car, and myself, should get this car in the 10.2X's. UPDATE 08/13/2009 Put Cobra Jet Springs in the back, changed to a Goodyear 29X11X15 slick, and completed the weight savings program. At Famoso the car turned a 10.277, a 10.280, and a 10.314 with a best 133.96 mph, just missing 134 mph. At Irwindale on 8/13/09, car ran very consistent as well, with 60' times of 1.432, 1.438, 1.427, and 1.454. Best ET was a 6.539 @ 105.85 mph. I think the Cobra Jet Springs definitely made a difference, as the car is still in the 1.42-1.43 area with a tire that is at least a full 1 inch taller then the M&H 325 I used to run. UPDATE 11/21/09 GETTING CLOSER! Only thing different is I changed the plugs, and actually had great conditions at a 1/4 mile track (Famoso). Temps in the very low 60s, great DA, good track prep. A new best of 10.138 @ 132.39 (lifted in the lights) backed up by a 10.194 @ 133.55---all with stock heads and stock cams still!! http://videos.streetfire.net/video/W...-at_720918.htm __________________ psfracer Last edited by psfracer; 11-22-2009 at 12:19 PM..
$psfracer is offline$

03-01-2009, 12:09 PM	#2
psfracer Prepare for glory! $psfracer's Avatar$ Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: 30 miles north of Los Angeles Posts: 3,791 iTrader: 16 / 100% $psfracer has a spectacular aura about$ $psfracer has a spectacular aura about$ $psfracer has a spectacular aura about$	This post will list suspension mods - weight reduction Front Suspension: 1) BMR tubular front K member -20lbs 2) BMR tubular a-arms non adjustable - 11lbs 3) Front sway bar crossmember delete - 11lbs (only 11 as I had already removed the stock front sway bar) 4) Strange front brake kit -36lbs 5) A/C delete -38lbs 6) Battery relocation to trunk 7) Intercooler water tank relocated to trunk So as it stands right now, I took off 116 lbs off of the front end alone. And that doesn't include going with the bogarts up front either--or moving the battery to the back--just the installed parts above. Here is the difference between the stock and BMR a-arms. That rear bushing on the stock one is huge, and is probably the source of most of the weight savings vs the bmr ones: Strange front brake kit weighs in at 33lbs Here is the strange kit installed on the car. It really looks like a quality kit--all though I haven't driven it yet---but if they stop as good as they look..... Only the lines are left, then the front suspension is done. A/C Delete: I already detailed how to remove the A/C in another thread, post #35: http://s197forum.com/forum/showthrea...t=10934&page=2 Rear Suspension: Sticking with how the car is set up--as this car has also has a best 60' time of 1.41X. 1) Strange engineering adjustable rear shocks. 2) BMR UCA and LCAs with solid mounts 3) BMR anti roll bar May add some anti squat brackets if needed. Geometry seems to be fine as it sits right now. __________________ psfracer Last edited by psfracer; 05-13-2009 at 12:29 AM..
$psfracer is offline$

03-01-2009, 12:09 PM	#3
psfracer Prepare for glory! $psfracer's Avatar$ Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: 30 miles north of Los Angeles Posts: 3,791 iTrader: 16 / 100% $psfracer has a spectacular aura about$ $psfracer has a spectacular aura about$ $psfracer has a spectacular aura about$	This post will list interior / exterior mods What I have planned for the interior so far: 1) Stereo delete (shaker 1000) -82lbs 2) Rear seat delete -25lbs (including all metal brackets, seat belts, etc) 3) Passenger seat delete -48lbs (with brackets) 4) Driver seat delete -60lbs (with brackets and power motors) 5) Kirkey seat, brackets, and cover +23lbs So as it stands right now, interior mods should yield somewhere in the neighborhood of 190lbs vs stock!! Stereo will be removed--with my gauge panel in its place: UPDATE 5/30/09 I installed the rear seat delete today. Could have made it myself for $30 but whatever---I had to cut two holes to make room for the roll bar--then I covered it up with the roll bar padding which makes it look pretty clean: There were alot of metal brackets, seat belts, etc I removed also, as I won't need them anymore. Kirky seat has already been installed, with belts, I just cleaned up the interior with simple green. I also installed my GHETTO dash camera mount. It works good, and with the camera actually on the mount, the only thing you can see is the black steel plate. TRUNK The battery box is now mounted in the spare tire wheel well along with the intercooler water tank. This places the weight of the 7 gallons of water and the battery square on the rear suspension. Also, this way it was easy to mount the master disconnect switch right where the license plate would normally go. The battery box I used was just the plain black one from Summit. It works great and was pretty inexpensive as well. __________________ psfracer Last edited by psfracer; 05-30-2009 at 05:05 PM..
$psfracer is offline$

03-01-2009, 12:11 PM	#4
psfracer Prepare for glory! $psfracer's Avatar$ Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: 30 miles north of Los Angeles Posts: 3,791 iTrader: 16 / 100% $psfracer has a spectacular aura about$ $psfracer has a spectacular aura about$ $psfracer has a spectacular aura about$	Engine mods, drivetrain, weight reduction recap, dyno, et timeslips ENGINE MODS Old set up was 2.3 whipple, 16psi, 577rwhp. 1) 10% overdrive crank pulley added. This will net me 600rwhp at 18+ psi 2) race tune to maximize custom CAI and sheet metal intake (believe it not I never got around to it) These two items should put me a little bit over the 600rwhp mark. But according to this calculator, I will need closer to 650 to break into the 9's at 3400lbs. http://www.wallaceracing.com/accel-calc.php Here is the dyno video: http://videos.streetfire.net/video/2...yno_683319.htm OR DRIVETRAIN 1) Detroit Locker 2) Moser axles with 3 inch studs All this time I have been running the stock limited slip. I have replaced the clutches once, but now have stepped up and decided to go with a locker. Should be able to 60' even better, as the stock limited slip was already starting to go out a second time. OTHER WEIGHT REDUCTION Exhaust mod: got ride of the axle backs and the exhaust tubing off of the x-pipe. Went with straight mufflers, which saved 26lbs per side, or 52lbs total. ETS SO FAR: Best 1/8th mile time so far a 6.49 @ 106 mph which should translate to a 10.1X at 133-134 mph. Best 1/4 mile time so far is a 10.377 @ 133 mph VIDEO OF SOME PASSES UPDATE 11/21/2009 Car turned a best 10.138 @ 132.39 MPH today at FAMOSO. Also turned a 10.19 and a 10.22. See video below: __________________ psfracer Last edited by psfracer; 01-07-2010 at 12:38 AM..
$psfracer is offline$

03-01-2009, 12:16 PM	#5
GI Joe Official Site Vendor Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 2,303 iTrader: 23 / 100%	crap man sorry to hear about your loss...but it looks like you have a good plan to turn lemons in to lemonaid... Gook Luck. __________________ Got Belt Slip? Get your 8 rib kit here www.BGGPERFORMANCE.com

03-01-2009, 12:16 PM	#6
DKO Shut up and die! Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: The Dirty South, South Carolina Posts: 1,019 iTrader: 11 / 100%	Damn Paul, nothing can keep you down! Congrats on the new ride, glad to hear that you're getting right back to it! __________________ 2003 Sonic Blue Cobra - 450whp/460tq

03-01-2009, 01:13 PM	#7
MLC40 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Naperville, IL Posts: 602 iTrader: 8 / 100%	+1 happy this is moving in a positive direction. __________________ KB 2.6@ 11 pounds, Innovators West balancer, ARH headers, Nexus gauges, Powerhouse DS, PRO50, BMR and Steeda suspension tuned by Livernois Motorsports

03-01-2009, 01:19 PM	#8
Chris06GT Just a "stock" GT.... Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Alabama Posts: 2,750 iTrader: 10 / 100%	Paul, I knew you were parting out the old car, but never knew what had happened....that sucks man, just glad you are ok....Roll bar done its job huh?.... On another note, I am glad to see you found another car, and it even looks like the old car...lol...Also, good luck with your goal, that would be an awesome accomplishment!!!!

03-01-2009, 01:24 PM	#9
Vapour Trails 0-118.7 mph in 12.07 secs Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Winnipeg, MB, Canada Posts: 1,053 iTrader: 4 / 100%	Looks like you found the perfect car, even the same color! __________________

03-01-2009, 01:41 PM	#10
thump_rrr Official Site Vendor Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Here and there Posts: 1,790 iTrader: 8 / 100%	Congrats on finding the perfect roller Paul. Is there a weight difference between what you were running as a trans to the 4R70W? Can you show in detail how those swingouts open please? I've never seen one that clean looking before. Do you now have 2 sets of Bogarts and will you be keeping both sets? __________________ Best Run S/C 1.643 60Ft., 7.216 1/8th mile @ 87.958, 11.139 1/4Mile @ 131.152 MPH is way off. http://www.thumpracing.com/

03-01-2009, 01:44 PM	#11
ILW84U Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Edmonton, Alberta Posts: 475 iTrader: 6 / 100%	Nice to see you're sticking with the S197. It looks as though you have a spare set of drag wheels now? Hopefully it won't be too long before you are back behind the wheel & racing again. __________________ 2005 GT, Livernois 298 Stroker & Stage 3 heads, BBR Stage 2 Cams, Procharger D-1SC (15 lbs.), GT500 fuel pump c/w Zone 5 MDM, BMR K-member, Built 4R70W & Lentech manual valve body with transbrake, Detroit Trutrac, ARH headers with Magnaflow Cat Back, CHE Adjustable UCA, LCAs, & Anti Squat Brackets, Cervinis Ram Air Hood, CDC Aggressive Chin Spoiler. 511 RWHP 475 RWTQ

03-01-2009, 01:51 PM	#15
Racingtheburg Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 572 iTrader: 11 / 100%	What size wheels are your street wheels? __________________ 301 RWHP 316 RWTQ http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/1258/sig22xm8.jpg

03-01-2009, 03:06 PM	#20
jp's performance shooting for 11.60's N/A Join Date: May 2007 Location: mass Posts: 443 iTrader: 11 / 100%	that looks just like brandi's car is it.nice grab __________________ 05 gt 5-speed manual,eric brooks tuned,.

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