Plug Design

So we all have had the scary ass experience of changing our plugs.
Will it break? Cross your fingers, knock wood, grit your teeth....
So now that there have been numerous horror stories the question comes up.
What have the manufactures done to fix this Dark Shadows problem?
There are several brands out there available.
NGK
Autolite
E3
Champion
Ect

So who has tried what, and what is your experience?

Champion has gone to a one piece shell design and had some quality issues at the start. These seem to have been corrected I hear.

But what about the rest?
Are they two piece shells?
Is the design any improvement over the OEM?
Electrode design?
Quality?

Lets hear it.

I just had another set of motorcrafts installed at the dealership. I bought them from American Muscle..they supposedly have a different part # than the OE plugs. The dealership said Ford made them pull all the plugs with the original part # and replace them with another part # with an improved design..not sure if thats BS or not. They said none of mine broke coming out (71k).

How many times must this be discussed here?

Twice a day ^

AbdullaGT said:

Twice a day ^

Click to expand...

LOL

keeno said:

I just had another set of motorcrafts installed at the dealership. I bought them from American Muscle..they supposedly have a different part # than the OE plugs. The dealership said Ford made them pull all the plugs with the original part # and replace them with another part # with an improved design..not sure if thats BS or not. They said none of mine broke coming out (71k).

Click to expand...

Correct, motorcrafts new plugs have the nickel plated sheaths and replaced the old all copper design.




To the op

Hopefully this response will end this one soon since all this info is already here in multiple threads.

Lots of companies make 2 piece plugs, alot. It was not the 2 piece design that was the initial problem for oem plugs from 05-mid 08. The problem was with the all copper design on the threads and sheath, over time they would corride and fuse togther thus making the plugs prone to breaking upon removal (2 piece design didnt help this as it made the plug weaker as well)

Autolite was the first to introduce an aftermarket oem style 2 piece plug that had an anti-corosion nickle plating on the sheath which stopped the corrosion and solved the problem. Fords answer was to change the head design to a 12mm one piece plug as well as incorporate a new oem motorcraft plug design that has the nickel plated shell as well for the older 16mm plugs. Thus the problem is completely gone unless you have oem plugs on an 05-08mid car that you havent changed yet.

NGK- good aftermarket plug for the 12mm new head design including heat range colder versions.

Autolite- best value and performance for original heads 16mm 2 piece design they have stock heat range ht1 and colder hto.

E3- waste of money, platinum bling fancy ground strap design to fool people, all platinum does it help with longevity of the plug, copper with the same old simple grounding strap is a better conducter and will produce more spark energy/power and is alot cheaper.

Champion-garbage for our cars, they need to stick to making lawn mover plugs

You forgot brisk, they also make plugs for our cars, they are very expensive and have mixed reviews, some people loved them and some have them fail and melt apart prematurely. Also available in many heat ranges.

I run Brisk plugs, I haven't had any issues out of them....yet.

Corrosion? I thought it was carbon buildup on the ground shield that ended up locking the plug in place.

I believe the Brisks come pre-gapped to .032 in case anyone would like to know.

Riptide said:

Corrosion? I thought it was carbon buildup on the ground shield that ended up locking the plug in place.

I believe the Brisks come pre-gapped to .032 in case anyone would like to know.

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Thats what "carbon" buildup is, its the metal oxidizng and interacting with hydrocarbons in the fuel and oil that will grow and fuse the all copper plug together over time, the nickel plating(nickel barely oxidizes at all and it takes a much longer time than copper) prevents the copper from mossing/treeing to it. When copper corrodes(oxidizes) it commonly forms copper carbonate which normaly appears green/white but in you car it looks a burnt blackish/brownish white from the heat/flame in the clyinder.

ixtlan said:

So we all have had the scary ass experience of changing our plugs.
Will it break? Cross your fingers, knock wood, grit your teeth....
So now that there have been numerous horror stories the question comes up.
What have the manufactures done to fix this Dark Shadows problem?
There are several brands out there available.
NGK
Autolite
E3
Champion
Ect

So who has tried what, and what is your experience?

Champion has gone to a one piece shell design and had some quality issues at the start. These seem to have been corrected I hear.

But what about the rest?
Are they two piece shells?
Is the design any improvement over the OEM?
Electrode design?
Quality?

Lets hear it.

Click to expand...

Motorcraft and Autolite. Haven't had an issue.

OP: What plugs have you tried and I would have to guess from your rant that you have had some break, true?

Lightblade said:

NGK- good aftermarket plug for the 16mm new head design including heat range colder versions.

Click to expand...

This is getting so fucking confusing. According to this post the old heads were 16mm plugs. You also have a post in that thread stating that the plugs for the new head design are 12mm. However you're saying that the new head design are 16mm right here. John at BBR stated that the HT0's they have on sale are 12mm. So are the 2005-early '08's 16 or 12.

So what the fuck is the right one?

Actually I was lucky on my plug change. They were a bitch but none broke in half. A couple broke internally though on removal.
As I understand the issue is carbon buildup locking the plug extension.
I presoaked mine with Stoddard solvent then cracked them loose a quarter turn and soaked again.
I have only had Autolight plugs and only changed once.
But at the time there was only two piece plugs.
Champion hadn't came out with the one piece yet.
We have discussed MANY plug problems and removals but never the design of the plugs.
I see E3 has this fancy electrode design but it never mentions in the company propaganda if they are one piece.
So the questions are still valid.
What is the latest in design that actually shows promise.

Lightblade thanks for the details.

longhornd00d said:

This is getting so fucking confusing. According to this post the old heads were 16mm plugs. You also have a post in that thread stating that the plugs for the new head design are 12mm. However you're saying that the new head design are 16mm right here. John at BBR stated that the HT0's they have on sale are 12mm. So are the 2005-early '08's 16 or 12.

So what the fuck is the right one?

Click to expand...

I mixed them around during my rant lol its fixed now.

OLD- 16mm

NEW -12mm

ixtlan said:

Actually I was lucky on my plug change. They were a bitch but none broke in half. A couple broke internally though on removal.
As I understand the issue is carbon buildup locking the plug extension.
I presoaked mine with Stoddard solvent then cracked them loose a quarter turn and soaked again.
I have only had Autolight plugs and only changed once.
But at the time there was only two piece plugs.
Champion hadn't came out with the one piece yet.
We have discussed MANY plug problems and removals but never the design of the plugs.
I see E3 has this fancy electrode design but it never mentions in the company propaganda if they are one piece.
So the questions are still valid.
What is the latest in design that actually shows promise.

Lightblade thanks for the details.

Click to expand...

Im on my third set of autolites no issues at all all. I ran ht1's n/a and run hto's with the turbo.

The only plugs that didnt show promise were the original oem motorcrafts. Which as of now have been replaced by the nickel plated ones. And of course the champions just suck period. lol


Recent thread discussing it

http://www.s197forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=53301&highlight=16mm+plugs

I am not completely sold on the Nickle plate being a cure all.
In my job I see nickle plating a lot.
Under heat conditions it doesn't corrode but rather crazes and then flakes exposing the underlying metal to corrosion.
Mainly because the nickle doesn't expand and contract at the same rate of the underlying metal. Nickle is brittle.
The latest is to add zinc to the nickle to make it more elastic to stop the crazing and thus the flaking.
Hopefully they have done this to the plating they use on the plugs too.
Otherwise I see the possibility of this on the plugs too.
Over the years I have always like Autolite. Basic but works.
Bosch was the worst. I tried their fancy electrode version on another car and all they did was missfire and cause problems. They came out and I never looked back.
Two piece designs still bother me.
Just a point that can fail.
A real Bad Place for that.
Still just thinking and getting opinions.
Experience is the best teacher.

Lightblade said:

I mixed them around during my rant lol its fixed now.

OLD- 16mm

NEW -12mm

Click to expand...

Awesome. Thank you! I've been going crazy trying to make sure I buy the right plugs for running nitrous.

ixtlan said:

I am not completely sold on the Nickle plate being a cure all.
In my job I see nickle plating a lot.
Under heat conditions it doesn't corrode but rather crazes and then flakes exposing the underlying metal to corrosion.
Mainly because the nickle doesn't expand and contract at the same rate of the underlying metal. Nickle is brittle.
The latest is to add zinc to the nickle to make it more elastic to stop the crazing and thus the flaking.
Hopefully they have done this to the plating they use on the plugs too.
Otherwise I see the possibility of this on the plugs too.
Over the years I have always like Autolite. Basic but works.
Bosch was the worst. I tried their fancy electrode version on another car and all they did was missfire and cause problems. They came out and I never looked back.
Two piece designs still bother me.
Just a point that can fail.
A real Bad Place for that.
Still just thinking and getting opinions.
Experience is the best teacher.

Click to expand...

I have never seen a single issue with a nickel plated plug for our cars. You have a point about the plating or coating but the time it would take to wear the coating away from heat cycles is far longer than the life span of the plugs anyway.

How many of us have actually had a problem removing the original oem all copper motorcrafts? For every thread you see where someone broke a plug you see 10-20 threads of guys excited and relieved that they got all the plugs out no problem. I know mine came out just fine with no issues. Maybe 10% of everyone that has removed them have had enough oxidation/buildup to break a plug. So the odds of even wearing down the nickel coating and then having an issue are slim to none really.

If your so concerend about the 2 piece design find a one piece if that helps ease you mind and call it a day.

longhornd00d said:

Awesome. Thank you! I've been going crazy trying to make sure I buy the right plugs for running nitrous.

Click to expand...

Lightblade said:

I have never seen a single issue with a nickel plated plug for our cars.
How many of us have actually had a problem removing the original oem all copper motorcrafts? For every thread you see where someone broke a plug you see 10-20 threads of guys excited and relieved that they got all the plugs out no problem. I know mine came out just fine with no issues. Maybe 10% of everyone that has removed them have had enough oxidation/buildup to break a plug. So the odds of even wearing down the nickel coating and then having an issue are slim to none really.

Click to expand...

My originals I got out.
But I tell you it was teeth wearin ordeal as they screeched out with every turn. And as I mentioned I broke a few internally.
Scary shit there and I have been wrenchin cars and aircraft for 40+ years.
They were the original 2005 version plugs. It is good t hear the nickle ones seem to be doing well.

So has anyone had any luck with the Bling Bling plugs like the E3's or Bosh +4/Fusion, or the NGK GPower or Iridium, Brisk LGS or Multispark, or any other Hi Tech design?

I know they generally make little to no difference over the conventional design plugs more Bling than Bang.

But hey I'm up to trying something new...

I did notice someone was running E3's, and Brisk.
How about a little technical feedback.
Notice anything over the standard? Or not?

I've been using HT0s for four years on my car and pulled the plugs several times with no problems once I used the nickel anti-seize on the ground sheild. I don't even pre-soak the plugs. Autolites work well for me and I wouldn't use any other. Lightblade - is it even necessary to use nickel antiseize with the new nickel plated plugs? I'll use it anyway but just curious.

No, but just a little wont hurt, just dont use too much as the plug wont torque properly and can unseat. Which worse case scenario would be if it comes loose enough will blow the plug out of the head. Seen it happen on a friends 2v, checked the other plugs and they were loose as well.

Do we need to gap the HT1's they come from the factory with .045.