Rich on one side - P2196 (passenger, bank 1)

[Wraith]

How did you verify voltage at the cop?


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[Flapjack]

How did you verify voltage at the cop?

No. How do I do that?

 

[Wraith]

With key on you should see 12v on one lead with volt meter. The trick I have not yet figured is how to get the signal wire verified to show the cop is getting its signal to fire the plug


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[Wraith]

http://easyautodiagnostics.com/ford/4.6L-5.4L/how-to-test-the-cop-coils-3

Seems like good source info?


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[Wraith]

I have fire and spark on that side so time for compression check......can't figure out anything else that would cause the drivers side to basically just act like its not firing at all.

 

[Flapjack]

I have fire and spark on that side so time for compression check......can't figure out anything else that would cause the drivers side to basically just act like its not firing at all.

Damn. That sucks. Compression is exactly the same across both banks and all cylinders for me. It's a little low overall, but I think that is because of how the cams were ground (for the 20* lockouts) and the fact that I've switched to the 0* lockouts.

I'm pretty damn certain it's electrical. I'm ordering a few of the items suggested on that site (which is great, by the way), like the HEI spark tester, LED test light, and some back probe multimeter leads... which I've needed for years now anyway.

 

[Wraith]

Actually going to do leak down instead we suspect the cam is 180 out. With 1@tdc 6 should be @tdc as well and have similar leak down. We suspect we will hear air on 6 coming out intake or exhaust [emoji35]


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[Flapjack]

Actually going to do leak down instead we suspect the cam is 180 out. With 1@tdc 6 should be @tdc as well and have similar leak down. We suspect we will hear air on 6 coming out intake or exhaust [emoji35]

I always hear this "cam 180 degree off" thing, but how often does this actually happen? I can't see how a cam could possibly be installed 180* off if you are at all trying to follow the instructions. Is it a simple thing to do? Wouldn't your compression suck ass? What were your compression test numbers?

 

[05stroker]

If y'all need to test for spark, all you have to do is pull the cop and leave it plugged in, then insert another plug and place the outside of the plug to metal. Then crank it over while someone is watching. It will spark. There are videos on YouTube of how to do this.

 

[Wraith]

We did that even pulled rail and injectors had fuel on them. We either have a mystery wiring gremlin or cam timing issue we think. A compression check won't tell us to much if the timing events are off as it would still build compression.


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[Flapjack]

If y'all need to test for spark, all you have to do is pull the cop and leave it plugged in, then insert another plug and place the outside of the plug to metal. Then crank it over while someone is watching. It will spark. There are videos on YouTube of how to do this.

I've done that before. I don't normally put a plug in... I just rest the coil spring near something metal. A spare plug would probably be easier, though... lol.

We did that even pulled rail and injectors had fuel on them. We either have a mystery wiring gremlin or cam timing issue we think. A compression check won't tell us to much if the timing events are off as it would still build compression.

You will still build compression, yes, but if the cam gears/chains are uneven, you'll have different compression numbers.

Of course, I have no idea what this whole 180* off thing is, unless it has to do with setting the cams in relation to the crank on the wrong stroke (compression vs exhaust). I can't see the compression being the same as a properly timed engine, however. It takes 5 minutes. Why not try it on cylinders 1 and 5, to at least rule that out?

 

[Wraith]

If I can get the fitting tomorrow am I will do compression numbers too.


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[Flapjack]

Yeah.... finding that fitting can be a pita.

 

[Wraith]

My builder swears I have electrical issue but I have reviewed all the wiring stuff online and of the paths I see that could cause a whole group of cop / injector to be down they all work. I don't rightly know beyond timing what else could cause this to happen over a whole bank of cylinders


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[Wes06]

hmm, wouldnt 180* off make it be correct for the 4 stroke cycle, however it would be 1 rotation off for when it fires?

I know at work on small engines, cam's being off 1/2/3 teeth is common, and easy to diagnose, however being off more than 90* just makes go from being 89* retarded to 89* advanced and installing it exactly 180 off<if you can eyeball it like that> means itll run just fine, considering it uses a magneto and fires each rotation not ONLY on the compression stroke.

So if its installed 180 off on ours the engine should only fire on compression stroke, but being off itll fire on the exhaust IIRC

 

[Wraith]

So if # 1 is tdc on compression stroke then # 6 should be tdc on exhaust stroke thus leak down on 1 should be minimal and 6 it should be significant if it's right(going out exhaust valve).


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[Wraith]

Pictures of how my timing was set by builder

Picture of correct:

Gonna start taking it apart to fix next week [emoji35]. Basically mine was set up R and R vs R and L as the pic above.


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[Wes06]

Welp

 

[Flapjack]

Gonna start taking it apart to fix next week [emoji35]. Basically mine was set up R and R vs R and L as the pic above

Just make sure before you start taking it apart. I definitely wouldn't want to mess with the front cover until you've done that compression test.

 

[Wraith]

Lito and i discussed and confirmed it was 180 out.

It's already down and ready to time

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