Faulty Axle Seals, anyone else?

[phoenix335]

This past weekend I had a Test-n-Tune Autox event and noticed that both axle seals were leaking (one very badly the other just a little). I took it to the dealer for replacement but wanted to find out if anyone else has had a similar issue.

The car is a 2013 GT, 6K miles, Track Package, Koni Sports, Steeda Ultralites, Vorshlag Plates (-2.5 deg), Eibach sway bars (front full stiff, rear middle hole), stock wheels and tires. I have maybe 8 AutoX events in the car and one PDX weekend, and the test-n-tune (about 30 long runs, abt 70 sec). Four of the TnT runs were on Hoosiers, which is why I noticed the gear oil all over the inside of the wheels. The Sway bars were installed two weeks ago, but I can't think that this would have any affect on the seals.

Any educated thoughts are appreciated, I am hoping this isn't a regular thing that I have to deal with, but given that Vorshlag has run their car way harder than I have I am hoping it is a faulty set of seals and it will be a one time thing.

 

[steveespo]

I had the left side go bad and replaced both. I think it was from brake heat and differential oil temp/pressure. I also have the Bobs catch can with vent and the vent on top of the cover to allow pressure to escape. Finally I installed a differential cooler and pump. Temps during a 25 minute track session get to 280 degrees without it, with it I can maintain 235.
No problems since changing the seals last spring.
Steve

 

[BAKnBLK2010]

I had a faulty axle seal on the drivers side of my 2012 with 7000 miles of pretty easy driving. Ford replaced it under warranty.

 

[fun4me]

Any pictures of what to look out for?

 

[steveespo]

I don't have pics but you will see a light oily film on the inside of the wheel. I had no other visible indication and thought it was brake fluid until I touched and smelled it. Rear axle lube smells like nothing else.
Steve

 

[phoenix335]

I had the left side go bad and replaced both. I think it was from brake heat and differential oil temp/pressure. I also have the Bobs catch can with vent and the vent on top of the cover to allow pressure to escape. Finally I installed a differential cooler and pump. Temps during a 25 minute track session get to 280 degrees without it, with it I can maintain 235.
No problems since changing the seals last spring.
Steve

Thanks for the input. I hadn't thought of the heat from braking, many back to back runs did heat up the brakes a tad! I don't think a cooler is legal for SCCA solo so i'll hold off on that but if it happens again i'll have to reconsider. Again hoping it was the back to back runs combined with a rather high speed course with hard braking included.

I had a faulty axle seal on the drivers side of my 2012 with 7000 miles of pretty easy driving. Ford replaced it under warranty.

Also good to know, perhaps it was just a faulty set or the installer was having an off day?


If it's a axle seal you will see a ring of gear oil in the center of the inside of the wheel all the way around. If it is bad enough it will coat just about everything inside the wheel and even be spun out of the wheel and will see it on the tires.

 

[Sky Render]

This past weekend I had a Test-n-Tune Autox event and noticed that both axle seals were leaking (one very badly the other just a little). I took it to the dealer for replacement but wanted to find out if anyone else has had a similar issue.

The car is a 2013 GT, 6K miles, Track Package, Koni Sports, Steeda Ultralites, Vorshlag Plates (-2.5 deg), Eibach sway bars (front full stiff, rear middle hole), stock wheels and tires. I have maybe 8 AutoX events in the car and one PDX weekend, and the test-n-tune (about 30 long runs, abt 70 sec). Four of the TnT runs were on Hoosiers, which is why I noticed the gear oil all over the inside of the wheels. The Sway bars were installed two weeks ago, but I can't think that this would have any affect on the seals.

Any educated thoughts are appreciated, I am hoping this isn't a regular thing that I have to deal with, but given that Vorshlag has run their car way harder than I have I am hoping it is a faulty set of seals and it will be a one time thing.

You! I know you!

I've had zero issues with mine leaking. It's odd that both seals let go at once, however. Maybe your rear axle was assembled on a Friday afternoon.

 

[Roadracer350]

I had the left side go bad and replaced both. I think it was from brake heat and differential oil temp/pressure. I also have the Bobs catch can with vent and the vent on top of the cover to allow pressure to escape. Finally I installed a differential cooler and pump. Temps during a 25 minute track session get to 280 degrees without it, with it I can maintain 235.
No problems since changing the seals last spring.
Steve

Do you have any pics of your pump and cooler?

 

[Mach2burnout]

If it's a axle seal you will see a ring of gear oil in the center of the inside of the wheel all the way around. If it is bad enough it will coat just about everything inside the wheel and even be spun out of the wheel and will see it on the tires.

Yep just like this:

Sent from iPhone

 

[Nuclear]

Same problem here. Anyone make a heavy-duty seal?

 

[modernbeat]

We had minor issues with the ones on the red track car, but we were punishing that axle. We still have hot rear brakes, but after swapping the clutch diff for the Torsen T2R most of our axle lube heat issues have vanished. We did replace the seals when we installed the T2R.

 

[Vorshlag-Fair]

We had minor issues with the ones on the red track car, but we were punishing that axle. We still have hot rear brakes, but after swapping the clutch diff for the Torsen T2R most of our axle lube heat issues have vanished. We did replace the seals when we installed the T2R.

Yes, this. We think it was the added heat diff fluid of a clutch style differential that might have done these in? They were burned up and leaking. We had the axles out a number of times previously, and they were inspected several times, but after a number of really hot track events with the TractionLok they were fried.

If you are seeing some diff fluid inside one or both rear wheels, and having a differential serviced, that's a great time to change these seals. Cheap, easy, done.

 

[steveespo]

Do you have any pics of your pump and cooler?

Yes I do.

 

[lost won]

Yep, same problem with 2012 GT/ Brembo pak on Hoosiers. About 6K miles and 25 F Stock SCCA autocross events/100 runs. Driver side only so far.

 

[Mach2burnout]

Strictly street driving mine never leaks a drop. That tells me the problem is the same as we used to see in our old circle track cars. Too much gear oil slung against the seals in the turns due to centrifugal force. There is product out there, I really don't remember the name, a baffle to slide over your axle to limit the amount of gear oil that gets to your seals.


Sent from iPhone

 

[modernbeat]

...There is product out there, I really don't remember the name, a baffle to slide over your axle to limit the amount of gear oil that gets to your seals.

I had forgotten about that! I've used it in pre-war Ford banjo style rear ends.

Had to look it up. Made by Seals-It.

http://www.sealsit.com/axlehub.asp

I'd be a little worried about it not allowing enough enough oil to the axle bearing during street driving.

 

[Mach2burnout]

I had forgotten about that! I've used it in pre-war Ford banjo style rear ends.

Had to look it up. Made by Seals-It.

http://www.sealsit.com/axlehub.asp

I'd be a little worried about it not allowing enough enough oil to the axle bearing during street driving.

Treed, I was just about to post a link too.

True, but what we used to do, before sliding the axle in was to pour a few ounces of gear oil in the axle tube to lube the bearing. Not much heat out there except for the brakes and on the street you really don't build that much heat from braking. You still get enough lube to the axle bearings without forcing it out through the seal during cornering. We used to run 100 lap events with no problem and in 12 years of racing we never had an axle bearing go bad. We even used roll bar padding a few times as a baffle. It worked but I never really liked doing it unless it was a must to get through an event.

you can look at Speedway Motors as well, that is a good site for a lot of specialty items such as that.

 

[modernbeat]

I remember that Seals-it having a weep hole in it to allow some oil, but not a lot of oil to move out to the axle bearing. Maybe it was a different one or maybe we drilled our own hole.

 

[phoenix335]

We had minor issues with the ones on the red track car, but we were punishing that axle. We still have hot rear brakes, but after swapping the clutch diff for the Torsen T2R most of our axle lube heat issues have vanished. We did replace the seals when we installed the T2R.

Yes, this. We think it was the added heat diff fluid of a clutch style differential that might have done these in? They were burned up and leaking. We had the axles out a number of times previously, and they were inspected several times, but after a number of really hot track events with the TractionLok they were fried.

If you are seeing some diff fluid inside one or both rear wheels, and having a differential serviced, that's a great time to change these seals. Cheap, easy, done.

Thanks for the feedback. I have the TORSEN diff, and while it's different from the T2R, I would think it is similar enough to reduce the diff fluid temps. Hopefully these will last a little longer. The dealer didn't give me any grief about the mods so As long as they continue to replace them It doesn't bother me too much.

Yep, same problem with 2012 GT/ Brembo pak on Hoosiers. About 6K miles and 25 F Stock SCCA autocross events/100 runs. Driver side only so far.

In my case the Hoosiers are new, I only have 15 on them. I do drive the car hard so it is what it is. I bought a couple of the seals to do myself if the dealer gave me any problems and looking at them the quality control on them didn't look to be what I would consider acceptable.

 

[phoenix335]

Steveespo...

Nice setup, I may look into this if the problem continues. I'm glad I have the diff cover with the drain and fill plugs already!