Greetings from Italy

[wakabamark]

just registered, I'm from Italy searching some infos on S197 4.6 3v 5R55s mustangs to buy one used (very rare in my country).

hope I'll enjoy my time here.

 

[Gladams]

Welcome to the club.

 

[Dino Dino Bambino]

just registered, I'm from Italy searching some infos on S197 4.6 3v 5R55s mustangs to buy one used (very rare in my country).

hope I'll enjoy my time here.

Buongiorno!
What specifically would you like to know?
Are you set on buying a 5R55S automatic or are you OK with a TR3650 manual? Keep in mind that any 5R55S with anywhere near 250k km is likely to be near the end of its lifespan, whereas the TR3650 is far more robust apart from 2nd gear being difficult to engage sometimes when cold.

 

[GriffX]

Welcome!

I don't know how the market for S197 in Italy is, but as a caveat, in Germany there are lot of salvage cars rebuild in Lithuania on the market. They all have indicators in the fenders and very often some glass fiber hoods.

 

[wakabamark]

Welcome to the club.

thank you!

Buongiorno!
What specifically would you like to know?
Are you set on buying a 5R55S automatic or are you OK with a TR3650 manual? Keep in mind that any 5R55S with anywhere near 250k km is likely to be near the end of its lifespan, whereas the TR3650 is far more robust apart from 2nd gear being difficult to engage sometimes when cold.

I need an automatic because after an old leg injury sadly I can't drive manual anymore.

my main concern with 5R55S is how good is for driving on hilly roads, because I live in a countryside that has a lot of them.
I've read that this gearbox is prone to overheat when stressed, but I've not understand if this happens under "sport driving" stress, like in drag or track race, or even in other/normal condition of driving.

I don't plan to race/sport drive with the mustang, but surely I have to drive it a lot in hilly roads...

My first choice would be a more recent mustang with the coyote and 6R80, but unfortunately here in italy there is a super high extra circulation/road tax (that sums up over the normal road tax that is already high) calculated on the engines that have more than 250hp/185kW, and it's exponential (you pay 20 euro on each 1kW over the 185 mark), so a 5.0 with 420hp will cost me something like 2500/3000+ euro a year of taxes only, even if I don't drive the car, and I can't afford that.
So my choice is limited to the 4.6 stangs (I really want a V8), and the good news is that when a car has 20 years from manufacturing, the extra tax will be removed.

the realiabiliy of the 5R55S is my main concern in the choice, but I don't plan to buy any heavily modified mustang, or cars with more than 150k km.

Welcome!

I don't know how the market for S197 in Italy is, but as a caveat, in Germany there are lot of salvage cars rebuild in Lithuania on the market. They all have indicators in the fenders and very often some glass fiber hoods.

thank you for the info!
the mustang market is really niche here, due to the super road tax mentionend before...
most of them are S550 2015-2018 ecoboost and some coyotes, the S197 are only import cars and are much rare than the S550 (officialy sold in europe from 2015).

I know of the salvage mustang market, expecially the S550s, and some dealer are already in my black list because of that, they mostly sell only salvage mustangs.

Have you some sample photos of those fenders with indicators that I can use to recognize a salvage S197?
many thanks

 

[GriffX]

That is a suspicious side blinker

Your taxes are ridiculous. Europe is heading to full blown communism, states living from other peoples money.

 

[86GT351]

Welcome!

 

[Dino Dino Bambino]

View attachment 97108
That is a suspicious side blinker

Your taxes are ridiculous. Europe is heading to full blown communism, states living from other peoples money.

Those taxes are beyond ridiculous but I'd call it self-inflicted stupidity. The EU has declared war on motorists with the aim of making car ownership affordable only for the elites. Just look at what they're doing with the latest Euro 7 emissions regs. It's a big scam. Big Brother wants to shut your car down so the engine won't start if a sensor detects a malfunction, and Big Brother will ensure there's a lot more sensors that add to the purchase cost of the car. Then Eurocrats wonder why the average age of cars in Europe is increasing. Well you idiots, it's because fewer people can afford to buy newer cars!!!

FWIW, my annual vehicle (scam) tax is €1312 because the car is in the highest tier for CO2 emissions (over 250g/km). That's nearly 15 times what my wife pays for her 1.6L Mini Cooper (€89 per year) despite my car putting out less than double the CO2 emissions!!

thank you!


I need an automatic because after an old leg injury sadly I can't drive manual anymore.

Fair enough.
In that case find the lowest mileage car that you can. Driving an automatic in mountains isn't a problem. You just need to get used to turning off the overdrive and, when going downhill, shifting the selector to a lower gear to make maximum use of engine braking and minimize the use of the foot brake (no cooked brake pads!!).

 

[stkjock]

Please read these

https://www.s197forum.com/threads/hawgmans-board-rules.133776/

https://www.s197forum.com/threads/a-s197-posting-etiquette-tutorial.89602/

https://www.s197forum.com/threads/tech-section-topics-please-read-new-guys-especially.30272/

 

[GriffX]

Those taxes are beyond ridiculous but I'd call it self-inflicted stupidity. The EU has declared war on motorists with the aim of making car ownership affordable only for the elites. Just look at what they're doing with the latest Euro 7 emissions regs. It's a big scam. Big Brother wants to shut your car down so the engine won't start if a sensor detects a malfunction, and Big Brother will ensure there's a lot more sensors that add to the purchase cost of the car. Then Eurocrats wonder why the average age of cars in Europe is increasing. Well you idiots, it's because fewer people can afford to buy newer cars!!!

FWIW, my annual vehicle (scam) tax is €1312 because the car is in the highest tier for CO2 emissions (over 250g/km). That's nearly 15 times what my wife pays for her 1.6L Mini Cooper (€89 per year) despite my car putting out less than double the CO2 emissions!!

Let's be frank, they declared war on us. They think, AI and robots will fulfill their needs, let's get rid of this useless eaters, or put them in buildings like "The Line" in Saudi Arabia. You don't need a car there and you cannot flee, how convenient.

My tax is 800€ but it was before the CO2 tax was introduced, I think it would be around 1200€ now.
EU introduced a new end-of-life law, that if your engine or transmission is blown you have to wreck your car. I'm afraid your workshop will inform the Government about this and you cannot do it yourself afterwards.

Never thought I will write such lines but I will vote for any party who ends this EU, no matter what.....

Buying a 4.6, listen to noises from the differential, in Germany it is very hard to find a workshop who can repair the diff (I did it myself therefore)

 

[1 Alibi 2]

Welcome to the s197 forum, good luck with your search..

 

[MasterofDisaster]

Welcome! Good luck finding a nice Mustang. I'm very happy with my 4.6 manual trans.

 

[yote0]

EU introduced a new end-of-life law, that if your engine or transmission is blown you have to wreck your car. I'm afraid your workshop will inform the Government about this and you cannot do it yourself afterwards.

Wow. I think I would end up dead or in jail over there. No way in hell I could put up with that shit.

 

[Ret]

First off welcome. You have come to a great site for help, guidance and opinion. 95 percent of these members know what they're talking about. I'm in the 5 percent so if I have mechanical advice, ignore it.

Reading all these comments makes me glad I'm nearly 86, years old. I own a 2012 Mustang 5.0 GT convertible and I live in the mountains. No issues at all with mountain roads and my automatic transmission.

 

[MADGT]

Welcome!

 

[BruceH]

just registered, I'm from Italy searching some infos on S197 4.6 3v 5R55s mustangs to buy one used (very rare in my country).

hope I'll enjoy my time here.

The automatic 4.6 3v Mustangs work well. It's only when you get above 450rwhp that it gets iffy. As a stock setup it's fantastic imo.

 

[wakabamark]

Your taxes are ridiculous. Europe is heading to full blown communism, states living from other peoples money.

Those taxes are beyond ridiculous but I'd call it self-inflicted stupidity. The EU has declared war on motorists with the aim of making car ownership affordable only for the elites. Just look at what they're doing with the latest Euro 7 emissions regs. It's a big scam. Big Brother wants to shut your car down so the engine won't start if a sensor detects a malfunction, and Big Brother will ensure there's a lot more sensors that add to the purchase cost of the car. Then Eurocrats wonder why the average age of cars in Europe is increasing. Well you idiots, it's because fewer people can afford to buy newer cars!!!

FWIW, my annual vehicle (scam) tax is €1312 because the car is in the highest tier for CO2 emissions (over 250g/km). That's nearly 15 times what my wife pays for her 1.6L Mini Cooper (€89 per year) despite my car putting out less than double the CO2 emissions!!


Fair enough.
In that case find the lowest mileage car that you can. Driving an automatic in mountains isn't a problem. You just need to get used to turning off the overdrive and, when going downhill, shifting the selector to a lower gear to make maximum use of engine braking and minimize the use of the foot brake (no cooked brake pads!!).

yeah I agree, that extra tax was introduced back in 2011 and has killed all the affordable sport cars market, in particular the hatchbacks, that here was very popular in '90s.

here we use to call it a "social envy tax", because it seems that politicians that invented it were trying to gather votes from people who cannot afford other than really cheap cars with small and underpowered engines... and so if you have a big motor/big power car, you are very rich and you must pay extra taxes.

funny facts is that most of last two decades small cars with small petrol engine had bad petrol consumption stats compared to larger sport engine...

Buying a 4.6, listen to noises from the differential, in Germany it is very hard to find a workshop who can repair the diff (I did it myself therefore)

thank you for the suggestion!

The automatic 4.6 3v Mustangs work well. It's only when you get above 450rwhp that it gets iffy. As a stock setup it's fantastic imo.

thank you, that's a nice news, I don't plan to mod the car, my goal is to reach 20 years from the date of construction with the stang as much stock as possibile, to be able to include the car in the national list of cars of historical relevance. The cars with that certifcation are tax exempt for the rest of their life, and the insurance costs are really reduced.

 

[GriffX]

Wow. I think I would end up dead or in jail over there. No way in hell I could put up with that shit.

Unfortunately, all the nightmare laws travel over the atlantic very fast in both directions. I'm sure we will adopt your car-remote-shut-off law very soon.

 

[Dino Dino Bambino]

thank you, that's a nice news, I don't plan to mod the car, my goal is to reach 20 years from the date of construction with the stang as much stock as possibile, to be able to include the car in the national list of cars of historical relevance. The cars with that certifcation are tax exempt for the rest of their life, and the insurance costs are really reduced.

I'll have to wait until March 2036 when my car will be 30 years old from the date of first registration to be eligible to register it as a classic car. Then my road tax will plummet but until then, I'll continue to swallow the bitter pill 'cause it's worth it. If I bought a newish car, it would cost me far more per year in depreciation alone.

funny facts is that most of last two decades small cars with small petrol engine had bad petrol consumption stats compared to larger sport engine...

That's no surprise. Considering our 4.6L engines have treble the displacement of the average European four cylinder (many engines of 1.5L or less are now three cylinder), the average fuel consumption is proportionately far less than expected. This shows that the larger engine consumes far less fuel per liter displacement (i.e. is more efficient) than the smaller one, but try telling that to small-minded green fanatics who still believe that EVs are the best thing since sliced bread!