Project "Keep it Cool"

[pacettr]

you cannot move coolant through the system too quickly. NEVER. Not a chance. The faster it moves the better.

I finally did some digging and this appears to be 100% accurate

 

[NUTCASE]

subscribed

my car is in its sophmore stage of modification however I do have long term plans for a built short block and a KB mammoth with tunes for both 93pump and E85 stored in the tuner.

I'm sure this will be useful for me to dig up in a year or so.


ok continue talking.....

 

[tmcolegr]

last picture...

this shows the spacial relationship between the windshield washer reservoir and the Meziere pump. Everything fits nicely.

 

[94tbird]

very clean install!

 

[white05gt]

Nice work, I really enjoy reading your write ups even if they don't apply to my setup. They are a great source of info for fellow members and your work is top notch.

 

[Redfire281]

Question: In the pic below (from post #34) if that is the AFCO H/E then it appears that the pump is connected to the outlet and you're pushing liquid from the bottom to the top of the H/E. Am I wrong? Is that okay to do if that's what's happening?

 

[tmcolegr]

Question: In the pic below (from post #34) if that is the AFCO H/E then it appears that the pump is connected to the outlet and you're pushing liquid from the bottom to the top of the H/E. Am I wrong? Is that okay to do if that's what's happening?

Sure am Kimosabi.

If you search this subject there are ton's of threads and theories on this exact topic.

 

[Redfire281]

Thanks! Looks like this is my next project.

 

[94tbird]

you should ALWAYS fill heat exchangers and radiators from the bottom. Not the Top. This promotes even cooling and a filled unit with no air pockets. It also has something to do with pressure and making sure it is even across the entire unit.

Its also why zamboni's in ice rinks fill their water tube from the bottom and the holes are at the top of the tube. it promotes even liquid and pressure from side to side as well.

 

[tbrock]

tmcolegr,

not trying to jack your thread as I have been religously following trying to learn some tricks to keep my AIT down. I just installed an AFCO HE with the stock saleen pump. I measure AIT's with a Saleen gauge connected to the ACT. Around town not in boost the gauge reads less than 100. When I start getting into boost the AIT jumps to 115 even after a couple of hard 2,3,4 WOT it only gets to 125 (ambient air temp 70). Weird thing is when I get home and pop the hood. I opened the I/C tank to check fluid level and make sure pump was circulating fluid. The fluid is cool the the touch? Tank is cool as well. Is this normal? I suspected with AIT at 125 degrees that the water would be warm/hot as would the tank. Fluid is circulating through my I/C tank. If you are facing the motor the left I/C outlet dumps into the top of the I/C tank which then flow down out of the tank to the top of the pump. The pump outlet to the HE (bottom). Out of the HE to the right side of the Super Charger I/C. I am just really confused that if the water is so cool to the touch then why the higher AIT, or is it just the heat from 10lbs of boost? Sorry if this is a dumb question.

Thanks

 

[94tbird]

My theory of why tbrock:

the reason its cool is you have very little fluid in the system combined with the HUGE Afco Heat exchanger. The bulk of the coolant in your system is inside the Heat exchanger, since the tank, lines and intercooler hold only small amounts at a time.

Now about your IAT's. Its a general rule that the s/c IAT temps will be about 30 degrees above ambient cruising or idling around at about 8psi. Its the nature of superchargers. compress air creates heat. For every 1psi of boost after 8psi, you can expect 10 degrees hotter IAT's at wide open throttle.

So if your ambient temp is 70 degrees, add 30 degrees(nature of the s/c at about 8psi) to bring you to 100 degrees IAT. since yourt runnig 10psi add 20 more degrees (2psi * 10 degrees) and your at 120 degrees. your temps follow the math perfectly.

 

[tbrock]

My theory of why tbrock:

the reason its cool is you have very little fluid in the system combined with the HUGE Afco Heat exchanger. The bulk of the coolant in your system is inside the Heat exchanger, since the tank, lines and intercooler hold only small amounts at a time.

Now about your IAT's. Its a general rule that the s/c IAT temps will be about 30 degrees above ambient cruising or idling around at about 8psi. Its the nature of superchargers. compress air creates heat. For every 1psi of boost after 8psi, you can expect 10 degrees hotter IAT's at wide open throttle.

So if your ambient temp is 70 degrees, add 30 degrees(nature of the s/c at about 8psi) to bring you to 100 degrees IAT. since yourt runnig 10psi add 20 more degrees (2psi * 10 degrees) and your at 120 degrees. your temps follow the math perfectly.

Thanks for the explanation. I am a rookie at this stuff. Makes perfect sense. I was worried and went over every connection, and flow last night to make sure the system was hooked up correctly.

 

[94tbird]

Bear in mind as well, it could be entirely possible that with the amount of fluid your system holds, and the majority of it being in the Heat exchanger, it wont take long to cool down at all, and by the time your done with a WOT run, pull over, p[op the hood and check, the pump already moved that fluid through the Heat Exchanger and cooled it. The AFCO is a ginourmous unit and extremely efficient.

 

[cycosarge]

I run the Canton battery box reservoir and the same Meziere pump as the OP in my KB supercharged '09 Mustang GT. The pump is the loudest thing in the car and I mounted it with bushings to keep it quieter. I switched to this system, not because of coolant temps but because of cavitation. I was getting air in the system a lot. I am still running the stock HE and I usually have AIT at about 85-90 degrees. After a few WOT runs, it may climb to 105-110 depending on the outside air temp, but quickly cools down to 90 degrees after running on the highway for 2-3 minutes. I am looking at switching out the HE as I am going to Texas this June and I want to know if the AFCO or FLUIDYNE is the best option?

 

[94tbird]

I jsut did the reaearch on this a few weeks ago. There is nothing larger thanthe AFCO. Its minutely bigger than the CR/Shelby unit. But it also has the largest fans, which also move the most air. for the price it cannot be beaten.

 

[fhlh]

Any reason one would not want to use this pump on a completely stock Saleen cooling system? TIA

 

[DiMora]

you cannot move coolant through the system too quickly. NEVER. Not a chance. The faster it moves the better.

Correct - I agree 100%.

Heat removed is a function of the ratio of the massflow of air outside the system to the massflow of fluid inside the system.

If you choose a given amount of air massflow through your heat exchanger (say via a given vehicle speed or via auxiliary fans if stopped) and you have a fixed coolant speed (inside the system based on the pump you choose) you have "set" your coefficient of heat transfer.

The only ways to change your coefficent of heat transfer are to increase surface area of the heat exchanger, increase fluid volume, increase fluid speed in the system, or a combination thereof.

So...a dual fan AFCO...or a pro-stock radiator modified for H/E duty, or whatever you whip up that is bigger than the small OEM type H/E's helps...then Canton / Moroso / custom icebox setups help with fluid volume...so the last logical variable is to increase flow rate. There is no such thing as too much flow, and the most restrictive part of the system is going to be the intake manifold's intercooler anyway.

The argument that the fluid needs to move slow enough to allow it to "soak up" heat is nonsense...the moving fluid in the system is in constant contact with the internal fins of both the heat exchanger and the intercooler, and increasing fluid speed will not have any negative affect whatsoever on heat transfer. At some point, since the intercooler is the most restrictive part of the system, if you could keep adding bigger and bigger pumps, you would see an increase in fluid pressure at the intercooler (restriction) without a commensurate proportionate increase in fluid speed.

Lastly, a product like water-wetter can increase capillary action on the molecular level interface between the fins and the fluid and help with heat transfer.

 

[908ssp]

I run the 55gpm Miezer pump in my car intercooler system and just finished installing one in another car today. The pump is very quiet. We noticed a significantly faster recovery time with the 55 gpm pump over the 20 gpm pump on this car making 650 rwhp.

 

[Department Of Boost]

So if your ambient temp is 70 degrees, add 30 degrees(nature of the s/c at about 8psi) to bring you to 100 degrees IAT. since yourt runnig 10psi add 20 more degrees (2psi * 10 degrees) and your at 120 degrees. your temps follow the math perfectly.

Try having a daily driver at 19psi. Keeping it cool is a whole new ballgame. The big Afco is not nearly enough for anything more than just put, put, putting around and jumping in it every once in a while. Run it through the gears once and it takes FOREVER to cool back down.

I should have left my car at 450hp.

 

[tmcolegr]

I run the 55gpm Miezer pump in my car intercooler system and just finished installing one in another car today. The pump is very quiet. We noticed a significantly faster recovery time with the 55 gpm pump over the 20 gpm pump on this car making 650 rwhp.

That's interesting...

I experimented with running the 55 GPM pump, and did not notice a faster recovery time nor lower IAT. After performing some tests, I determined you can not shove more than 20 GPM through the stock Saleen I/C.